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		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?action=history&amp;feed=atom&amp;title=Talk%3AClub</id>
		<title>Talk:Club - Revision history</title>
		<link rel="self" type="application/atom+xml" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?action=history&amp;feed=atom&amp;title=Talk%3AClub"/>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;action=history"/>
		<updated>2026-04-21T21:08:56Z</updated>
		<subtitle>Revision history for this page on the wiki</subtitle>
		<generator>MediaWiki 1.30.0</generator>

	<entry>
		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=42459&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>Bwijn: /* Enchanted! */ reply</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=42459&amp;oldid=prev"/>
				<updated>2016-06-24T11:10:59Z</updated>
		
		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;‎&lt;span dir=&quot;auto&quot;&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;autocomment&quot;&gt;Enchanted!: &lt;/span&gt; reply&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table class=&quot;diff diff-contentalign-left&quot; data-mw=&quot;interface&quot;&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;tr style=&quot;vertical-align: top;&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 11:10, 24 June 2016&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l8&quot; &gt;Line 8:&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot;&gt;Line 8:&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;So, hey, I came across a +8 club, Jessica was carrying it. I imagine it should be recorded here that that CAN, in fact, happen to them, and we should get the special graphic for it, right? --[[User:Haelyn|Haelyn]] ([[User talk:Haelyn|talk]]) 03:20, 24 June 2016 (CEST)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;So, hey, I came across a +8 club, Jessica was carrying it. I imagine it should be recorded here that that CAN, in fact, happen to them, and we should get the special graphic for it, right? --[[User:Haelyn|Haelyn]] ([[User talk:Haelyn|talk]]) 03:20, 24 June 2016 (CEST)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;:Don't forget that those enchanted clubs are *very* rare, cursed bad ones are much more frequent. But indeed, a special graphic is logically necessary. -- [[User:Bwijn|Bwijn]] ([[User talk:Bwijn|talk]]) 13:10, 24 June 2016 (CEST)&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Bwijn</name></author>	</entry>

	<entry>
		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=42457&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>Haelyn at 01:20, 24 June 2016</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=42457&amp;oldid=prev"/>
				<updated>2016-06-24T01:20:38Z</updated>
		
		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table class=&quot;diff diff-contentalign-left&quot; data-mw=&quot;interface&quot;&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;tr style=&quot;vertical-align: top;&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 01:20, 24 June 2016&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l3&quot; &gt;Line 3:&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot;&gt;Line 3:&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;::Also, don't forget that a cursed club can disrupt your diet pretty badly, especially if you're casting spells regularly. Remove Curse is common, but not guaranteed. Just ask any ogre player... --[[User:MoogleDan|MoogleDan]] 13:50, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;::Also, don't forget that a cursed club can disrupt your diet pretty badly, especially if you're casting spells regularly. Remove Curse is common, but not guaranteed. Just ask any ogre player... --[[User:MoogleDan|MoogleDan]] 13:50, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;:::Thanks. I've generally used a club because it seems to break through AC better on some of the sturdier enemies on the first few floors (like giant cockroaches). I guess it all comes down to personal preference as to which type of crap one's early mage will be flailing away with. [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 20:41, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;:::Thanks. I've generally used a club because it seems to break through AC better on some of the sturdier enemies on the first few floors (like giant cockroaches). I guess it all comes down to personal preference as to which type of crap one's early mage will be flailing away with. [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 20:41, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;== Enchanted! ==&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;So, hey, I came across a +8 club, Jessica was carrying it. I imagine it should be recorded here that that CAN, in fact, happen to them, and we should get the special graphic for it, right? --[[User:Haelyn|Haelyn]] ([[User talk:Haelyn|talk]]) 03:20, 24 June 2016 (CEST)&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Haelyn</name></author>	</entry>

	<entry>
		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9040&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>Spudwalt at 19:41, 4 March 2013</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9040&amp;oldid=prev"/>
				<updated>2013-03-04T19:41:32Z</updated>
		
		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table class=&quot;diff diff-contentalign-left&quot; data-mw=&quot;interface&quot;&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;tr style=&quot;vertical-align: top;&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 19:41, 4 March 2013&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l2&quot; &gt;Line 2:&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot;&gt;Line 2:&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;:Clubs are 5 damage, +3 acc, 13 delay.&amp;#160; Unarmed at zero is 3 damage, +2 acc, 10 delay.&amp;#160; While the club does do more damage per aut, I'd still go with the unarmed: with 10 delay, you're not going to get surprised by getting hit twice and annihilated: you can always start kiting the monster if you get hit.&amp;#160; One other point, though, is that a dagger or whip will be preferable to either, and both are fairly common D:1 &amp;lt;s&amp;gt;trash&amp;lt;/s&amp;gt; items. -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 08:28, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;:Clubs are 5 damage, +3 acc, 13 delay.&amp;#160; Unarmed at zero is 3 damage, +2 acc, 10 delay.&amp;#160; While the club does do more damage per aut, I'd still go with the unarmed: with 10 delay, you're not going to get surprised by getting hit twice and annihilated: you can always start kiting the monster if you get hit.&amp;#160; One other point, though, is that a dagger or whip will be preferable to either, and both are fairly common D:1 &amp;lt;s&amp;gt;trash&amp;lt;/s&amp;gt; items. -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 08:28, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;::Also, don't forget that a cursed club can disrupt your diet pretty badly, especially if you're casting spells regularly. Remove Curse is common, but not guaranteed. Just ask any ogre player... --[[User:MoogleDan|MoogleDan]] 13:50, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;::Also, don't forget that a cursed club can disrupt your diet pretty badly, especially if you're casting spells regularly. Remove Curse is common, but not guaranteed. Just ask any ogre player... --[[User:MoogleDan|MoogleDan]] 13:50, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;:::Thanks. I've generally used a club because it seems to break through AC better on some of the sturdier enemies on the first few floors (like giant cockroaches). I guess it all comes down to personal preference as to which type of crap one's early mage will be flailing away with. [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 20:41, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Spudwalt</name></author>	</entry>

	<entry>
		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9019&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>MoogleDan at 12:50, 4 March 2013</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9019&amp;oldid=prev"/>
				<updated>2013-03-04T12:50:18Z</updated>
		
		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table class=&quot;diff diff-contentalign-left&quot; data-mw=&quot;interface&quot;&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;col class=&quot;diff-content&quot; /&gt;
				&lt;tr style=&quot;vertical-align: top;&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 12:50, 4 March 2013&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l1&quot; &gt;Line 1:&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot;&gt;Line 1:&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that's the only thing I can find for the first couple floors?) [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 07:42, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that's the only thing I can find for the first couple floors?) [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 07:42, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;:Clubs are 5 damage, +3 acc, 13 delay.&amp;#160; Unarmed at zero is 3 damage, +2 acc, 10 delay.&amp;#160; While the club does do more damage per aut, I'd still go with the unarmed: with 10 delay, you're not going to get surprised by getting hit twice and annihilated: you can always start kiting the monster if you get hit.&amp;#160; One other point, though, is that a dagger or whip will be preferable to either, and both are fairly common D:1 &amp;lt;s&amp;gt;trash&amp;lt;/s&amp;gt; items. -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 08:28, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;:Clubs are 5 damage, +3 acc, 13 delay.&amp;#160; Unarmed at zero is 3 damage, +2 acc, 10 delay.&amp;#160; While the club does do more damage per aut, I'd still go with the unarmed: with 10 delay, you're not going to get surprised by getting hit twice and annihilated: you can always start kiting the monster if you get hit.&amp;#160; One other point, though, is that a dagger or whip will be preferable to either, and both are fairly common D:1 &amp;lt;s&amp;gt;trash&amp;lt;/s&amp;gt; items. -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 08:28, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;::Also, don't forget that a cursed club can disrupt your diet pretty badly, especially if you're casting spells regularly. Remove Curse is common, but not guaranteed. Just ask any ogre player... --[[User:MoogleDan|MoogleDan]] 13:50, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>MoogleDan</name></author>	</entry>

	<entry>
		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9017&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>Ion frigate at 07:28, 4 March 2013</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9017&amp;oldid=prev"/>
				<updated>2013-03-04T07:28:06Z</updated>
		
		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table class=&quot;diff diff-contentalign-left&quot; data-mw=&quot;interface&quot;&gt;
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				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 07:28, 4 March 2013&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l1&quot; &gt;Line 1:&lt;/td&gt;
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&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that's the only thing I can find for the first couple floors?) [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 07:42, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that's the only thing I can find for the first couple floors?) [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 07:42, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot;&gt;&amp;#160;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class='diff-marker'&gt;+&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;:Clubs are 5 damage, +3 acc, 13 delay.&amp;#160; Unarmed at zero is 3 damage, +2 acc, 10 delay.&amp;#160; While the club does do more damage per aut, I'd still go with the unarmed: with 10 delay, you're not going to get surprised by getting hit twice and annihilated: you can always start kiting the monster if you get hit.&amp;#160; One other point, though, is that a dagger or whip will be preferable to either, and both are fairly common D:1 &amp;lt;s&amp;gt;trash&amp;lt;/s&amp;gt; items. -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 08:28, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Ion frigate</name></author>	</entry>

	<entry>
		<id>http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9016&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>Spudwalt: Created page with &quot;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that's the...&quot;</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://crawl.chaosforge.org/index.php?title=Talk:Club&amp;diff=9016&amp;oldid=prev"/>
				<updated>2013-03-04T06:42:48Z</updated>
		
		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Created page with &amp;quot;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that&amp;#039;s the...&amp;quot;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;b&gt;New page&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div&gt;Are clubs better than untrained unarmed combat? (i.e. should my weak and noodly mage pick up a club for use as an emergency weapon at the very beginning of the game if that's the only thing I can find for the first couple floors?) [[User:Spudwalt|--spudwalt]] 07:42, 4 March 2013 (CET)&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>Spudwalt</name></author>	</entry>

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