Weapon choice - Revision history

Hordes: 0.33 bump

2025-12-06T15:09:45Z

0.33 bump

Hordes at 20:46, 15 April 2025

2025-04-15T20:46:20Z

Hordes: /* Weapon Types */

2024-08-26T16:58:27Z

‎Weapon Types

Hordes at 18:40, 15 March 2024

2024-03-15T18:40:05Z

Hordes: CKO is dead so the refs are useless

2024-02-17T05:02:36Z

CKO is dead so the refs are useless

Hordes at 07:07, 25 January 2024

2024-01-25T07:07:32Z

Hordes: +qbs, comment out the LB sources (they aren't ''that''' common, if you're gonna list sources for one, list 'em all)

2024-01-24T22:24:38Z

+qbs, comment out the LB sources (they aren't ''that''' common, if you're gonna list sources for one, list 'em all)

Hordes: more slight adjustments

2024-01-24T22:18:33Z

more slight adjustments

Hordes: better accoutn for commit aa4cf24

2024-01-24T22:12:53Z

better accoutn for commit aa4cf24

Hordes: /* Shield or Two-Handed? */ update the blocking examples

2024-01-24T22:10:08Z

‎Shield or Two-Handed?: update the blocking examples

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-{{version031}}
+{{version033}}
 {{advice}}
 ''Crawl'' presents the player and character with a potentially bewildering array of '''[[weapon]] choices'''. However, when all the dust clears and the parade of short swords, demon whips, and clubs has passed by, weapons have a few main properties:
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 *[[Staves]]:
 **Non-magical staves have no special features, but have low base delay relative to their damage output.
-**Magical staves are weak, but enhance your [[spell power]], and have special bonus to melee.
+**Magical staves are weak, but enhance your [[spell power]], and have a special attack for melee.
 *[[Unarmed Combat]] is always available. Skill has a strong impact on unarmed combat, but your fists cannot be [[enchant]]ed or [[brand]]ed.
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 '''Top Weapons'''
-*If you have good sources of flat damage, [[quick blade]]s are the strongest short blade. Daggers might have a higher stab bonus, but since quick blades attack faster, they get more stabs.
+*If you have good sources of flat damage, [[quick blade]]s are the strongest short blade for nearly all purposes. While daggers may get a stab bonus, quick blades attack twice as fast (and therefore get twice as many stabs, outpacing the dagger for everything but sleep).
 *[[Rapier]]s are a lot more common than quick blades. Without a major source of flat damage, they have similar or better damage output than quick blades.
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 ===[[Long Blades]]===
-Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Barachi]], [[Minotaur]], [[Merfolk]])
+Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Barachi]], [[Minotaur]]), +1 ([[Merfolk]], [[Tengu]])
-Long Blades are plain weapons with good stats. They scale with dexterity, so are suited towards [[Dodging]]-reliant characters. They also cross-train with Short Blades. However, you shouldn't ignore an awesome [[artefact]] Long Blade just because you're a "heavy armour character".
+Long Blades are plain weapons with good stats. They scale with dexterity, so are best suited towards [[Dodging]]-reliant characters. They also cross-train with Short Blades. However, you shouldn't ignore an awesome [[artefact]] Long Blade just because you're a "heavy armour character".
 '''Top Weapons'''
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 ===[[Maces & Flails]]===
-Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Minotaur]]), +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Hill Orc]], [[Tengu]])
+Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Minotaur]], [[Mountain Dwarf]]), +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Tengu]])
 Maces & Flails have no special gimmick, but have better stats to make up for it (around the same as Long Blades). Unlike Long Blades, Maces & Flails scale with strength.
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 ===[[Axes]]===
-Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Minotaur]]), +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Hill Orc]], [[Tengu]])
+Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Minotaur]], [[Mountain Dwarf]]), +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Tengu]])
 Axes have cleaving - when you attack a monster, every other monster adjacent to you is hit for 70% damage. (The original target is still hit for 100% damage.)
@@ Line 162: / Line 162: @@
 ===[[Polearms]]===
-Highest aptitudes: +3 ([[Merfolk]]), +2 ([[Minotaur]])
+Highest aptitudes: +4 ([[Merfolk]]), +2 ([[Minotaur]])
 Polearms have [[reaching]] - they can attack from two tiles away, instead of just one. You can attack behind your own [[allies]], but with a 50% chance to fail. Against most enemies, this lets you get one "extra" attack off.
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 '''Top Weapons'''
-*The strongest one-handed weapon is the [[demon trident]].
+*The strongest one-handed weapons are the [[demon trident]] and [[partisan]], which are roughly equal to each other.
 *The strongest two-handed weapon is the [[bardiche]].
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 '''Disadvantages'''
 *Worse stats compared to other weapons.
 **Small species have no good one-handed options.
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 *Weak base type that can't be [[enchant]]ed or [[brand]]ed.
 *Most magical staves deal elemental damage, and are subject to enemy resistances.
-*Requires magic skill and [[Evocations]] to be competent, in addition to Staves skill.
+*Requires magic skill and [[Evocations]] to be competent in melee, in addition to Staves skill.
 ==Non-Standard Weapons==
 ===[[Unarmed Combat]]===
-Highest aptitudes: +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Ghoul]], [[Hill Orc]], [[Minotaur]])
+Highest aptitudes: +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Minotaur]], [[Revenant]])
 Of course, you don't have to wield a weapon to kill foes; it's perfectly feasible to beat things to death with your fists. Whether or not it's worthwhile largely depends on your build.
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 **[[Distortion]] is even better than electrocution, but with a drawback: if you unwield a distortion weapon, you get nasty side effects.
-*If you find an endgame tier weapon early, consider using it, at least for the long-term. For example, [[Amaemon]] always wields a [[demon whip]], a weapon which is great for an entire 3-rune game. In this case, demon whips don't require a lot of skill, so you can switch to it relatively early.
+*If you find an endgame tier weapon early, consider using its school, at least in the long-term. For example, [[Amaemon]] always wields a [[demon whip]], a weapon which is great for an entire 3-rune game. In this case, demon whips don't require a lot of skill, so you can switch to it relatively early.
 *A key breakpoint is when you '''reach 1.0 weapon delay'''. When you're above 1.0 delay, a 100% speed monster can potentially get a double-turn for every weapon swing you make (i.e. 1.1 may effectively round up to 2). After you reach this point, there exists a major cost for switching weapon types. It's not impossible to switch, especially if you have cross-training, but it becomes less desirable to do so.

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 '''Damage boosted by dexterity:'''
-*[[Short Blades]] are weak, but give a bonus to [[stab]] damage, and attack quickly.
+*[[Short Blades]] have low base damage, but give a bonus to [[stab]] damage, and attack quickly.
 *[[Long Blades]] have no special features, but have above average stats.
-*[[Ranged Weapons]] can attack from any distance. However, they are weaker, and are heavily penalized for heavy body armour.
+*[[Ranged Weapons]] can attack from any distance. However, they are weaker, and are penalized by body armour (heavy penalties with heavy armour).
 '''Damage boosted by strength:'''
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 *[[Unarmed Combat]] is always available. Skill has a strong impact on unarmed combat, but your fists cannot be [[enchant]]ed or [[brand]]ed.
-In addition, certain weapons cut [[hydra]] heads, including: Long Blades, Axes, two-handed Polearms, and lajatangs. Cutting hydra heads is a bad thing unless the weapon has the [[flaming]] brand. If you cut a hydra's head, two more will grow back.
+In addition, certain weapons cut [[hydra]] heads, including: Long Blades, Axes, two-handed Polearms, and lajatangs. Cutting hydra heads is a bad thing unless the weapon has the [[flaming]] brand, since if you cut a hydra's head, two more will grow back.
 ==Weapon Types==
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 Highest aptitudes: +3 ([[Kobold]]), +2 ([[Merfolk]])
-Short Blades are best used for stabbers, whether you're using [[Hexes]], [[stealth]], or [[god]]s (namely [[Uskayaw]]) to stab enemies.
+Short Blades are best used by stabbers, whether you're using [[Hexes]], [[stealth]], or [[god]]s (e.g., [[Uskayaw]]) to stab enemies.
 When not stabbing, Short Blades attack fast, but weak. Thus, they benefit most from sources of "flat" damage. For example, you have a chance to make an [[auxiliary attack]] ''per hit'', no matter how strong it is. Short Blades, swinging faster, activate more auxiliary attacks. However, they are hindered most by [[AC]], a flat source of damage reduction. Overall, Short Blades have below average damage output.
-Note that an early Short Blade of [[venom]] or [[electrocution]] can be a boon for the early game. Both venom and elec are flat damage brands, and both daggers and short swords are more likely to have these brands. Even at 0 skill, a dagger of venom can tear monsters before [[Lair]]. (This does not mean you should train Short Blades skill, though. It's the brand that's doing most of the work, not the weapon, so no need to train further.)
+Note that an early Short Blade of [[venom]] or [[electrocution]] can be a boon for the early game. Both venom and elec are flat damage brands, and both daggers and short swords are more likely to initially generate with these brands. Even at 0 skill, a dagger of venom can tear monsters before [[Lair]]. (This does not mean you should train Short Blades skill, though. It's the brand that's doing most of the work, not the weapon, so no need to train further.)
 '''Top Weapons'''
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 '''Disadvantages'''
-*Low damage without stabbing (even with flat damage)
+*Low damage without stabbing (even considering flat damage)
 **Especially poor against foes with high [[AC]].
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 Polearms have [[reaching]] - they can attack from two tiles away, instead of just one. You can attack behind your own [[allies]], but with a 50% chance to fail. Against most enemies, this lets you get one "extra" attack off.
-[[Spear]]s are the best "simple" starting weapons (before considering [[aptitude]]s). While their damage/turn is slightly worse, the reaching makes up for it. Also, spears can attack <= 1.0 delay with just your starting skill.
+[[Spear]]s are the best "simple" starting weapons (before considering [[aptitude]]s). While their raw damage/turn is slightly worse, the reaching makes up for it. Also, spears can attack <= 1.0 delay with just your starting skill, and their accuracy helps too.
 '''Top Weapons'''
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 '''Advantages'''
-*Reaching; allows one extra attack in melee.
+*Reaching:
-*Synergy with [[summon]]s, [[allies]], [[deep water]], etc. - you can attack behind them.
+**In many situations, allows one extra attack in melee.
 *Cross-trains with Axes and Maces & Flails.

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 Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Barachi]], [[Minotaur]], [[Merfolk]])
-Long Blades are plain weapons. They scale with dexterity, so are suited towards [[Dodging]]-reliant characters. They also cross-train with Short Blades. However, you shouldn't ignore an awesome [[artefact]] Long Blade just because you're a "heavy armour character".
+Long Blades are plain weapons with good stats. They scale with dexterity, so are suited towards [[Dodging]]-reliant characters. They also cross-train with Short Blades. However, you shouldn't ignore an awesome [[artefact]] Long Blade just because you're a "heavy armour character".
 '''Top Weapons'''
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 '''Advantages'''
 *Highest damage melee weapon that uses dexterity.
-*Cross-trains with Short Blades, which also use dexterity, and have stronger stabs.
+*Cross-trains with Short Blades, which also use dexterity and boost stab damage.
 <!--*There are a couple good sources of Long Blades:
 **[[Efreet]]s and [[Erica]] always spawn with a [[flaming]] scimitar (Good against [[hydra]]s!).
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 Highest aptitudes: +2 ([[Minotaur]]), +1 ([[Barachi]], [[Hill Orc]], [[Tengu]])
-Maces & Flails have no special gimmick, but have better stats to make up for it. Unlike Long Blades, Maces & Flails scale with strength.
+Maces & Flails have no special gimmick, but have better stats to make up for it (around the same as Long Blades). Unlike Long Blades, Maces & Flails scale with strength.
 '''Top Weapons'''
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 ===[[Magical staves|Magical Staves]]===
-Magical staves' main purpose is to boost the [[spell power|power]] of certain spells. They can still be alright melee weapons, though. When using a magical staff in melee, you get a special damage bonus. This bonus scales off your skill in the staff's magic school, as well as [[Evocations]].
+Magical staves' main purpose is to boost the [[spell power|power]] of certain spells. They can still be alright melee weapons, though. When using a magical staff in melee, you get a special damage bonus. This bonus scales off your skill in the staff's magic school, as well as [[Evocations]]. Magical staves can't be enchanted or branded.
 '''Advantages'''
@@ Line 207: / Line 207: @@
 '''Disadvantages'''
-*Weak base type.
+*Weak base type that can't be [[enchant]]ed or [[brand]]ed.
 *Most magical staves deal elemental damage, and are subject to enemy resistances.
 *Requires magic skill and [[Evocations]] to be competent, in addition to Staves skill.

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 *If you find an endgame tier weapon early, consider using it, at least for the long-term. For example, [[Amaemon]] always wields a [[demon whip]], a weapon which is great for an entire 3-rune game. In this case, demon whips don't require a lot of skill, so you can switch to it relatively early.
-*A key breakpoint is when you '''reach 1.0 weapon delay'''. When you're above 1.0 delay, a 100% speed monster can potentially get a double-turn for every weapon swing you make (i.e. 1.1 may effectively round up to 2). After this point, there exists a major cost for switching weapon types. It's not impossible to switch, especially if you have cross-training, but it becomes less desirable to do so.
+*A key breakpoint is when you '''reach 1.0 weapon delay'''. When you're above 1.0 delay, a 100% speed monster can potentially get a double-turn for every weapon swing you make (i.e. 1.1 may effectively round up to 2). After you reach this point, there exists a major cost for switching weapon types. It's not impossible to switch, especially if you have cross-training, but it becomes less desirable to do so.
 *You'll want to keep a ranged weapon around, even without any training. Against a melee enemy, you can switch to the ranged weapon, take a few potshots, then switch back to your primary weapon. You should not fight ranged enemies this way, since an untrained weapon fires slowly.
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 ==Judging Artefacts==
 [[Artefact]]s may look slick, have a cool name, and a bunch of perks. But when are they good?
-*Firstly, look at their enchantment, brand, and base type. A artefact +6 [[trident]] of freezing is still a +6 trident of freezing, except you can't even enchant it. Whenever this is good is largely gamestate dependent: a novice [[merfolk]] stuck with a [[spear]] might gladly take it, but its all but useless in combat compared to [[demon trident]] wielders.
+*Firstly, look at their enchantment, brand, and base type. A artefact +6 [[trident]] of freezing is still a +6 trident of freezing, except that you can't even [[enchant]] it. Whenever this is good is largely dependent on the gamestate: a novice [[Merfolk]] stuck with a [[spear]] will gladly take it, but its all but useless in combat when compared to a [[demon trident]].
-**As mentioned above, if you've trained significant amounts in another weapon skill, and don't even have cross-training for the artefact, don't consider it. However, in the early game, you won't have significant skill training. Many artefacts - simply due to high enchantment - will carry you through the early game, and are worth considering. You can swap to the artefact or use the artefact at 0 skill.
+**As mentioned above, if you've trained significant amounts in another weapon skill, and don't even have cross-training for the artefact, don't consider it. However, in the early game, you won't have significant skill training. Many artefacts - simply due to their high enchantment - will carry you through the early game, and are worth considering. You can swap to the artefact after training, or use it at 0 skill.
-*Some [[Randart#Properties|properties]] are dangerous to wield, namely *Slow and *Rage. It's certainly still possible to use weapons with them, though you'll have to remain aware of their risks. Other negative properties like *Drain and *Corrode are much more tolerable in comparison.
+*Some [[Randart#Properties|properties]] are dangerous to wield, namely *Slow and *Rage. It's certainly possible to use weapons with them, though you'll have to be aware of their risks. Other negative properties like *Drain and *Corrode are much more tolerable in comparison.
 *Small stat modifiers don't matter much; -2 strength is a minimal decrease to damage. However, big modifiers do: +8 strength increases your damage significantly; +10 dexterity will greatly improve [[EV]]. Also, certain characters might have to beware of [[stat zero]].
-*It might be worth keeping a weapon around if it provides some [[resistances]], even if you never use it as a weapon. You can wield said weapon for resistances when retreating, using [[wand]]s/[[Throwing]], and so on.
+*It might be worth keeping a weapon around if it provides some [[resistances]], even if you never use it as a weapon. Against a dangerous elemental opponent, you can wield the resistance-giving weapon, then use [[wand]]s, [[Throwing]], and/or [[god]] abilities to take it out.
 ==Shield or Two-Handed?==
 Two-handed weapons deal more damage, but shields provide valuable defense. Which should you choose?
-*Even when counting unblockable attacks, a trained +8 tower shield can block >50% of all attacks in a game. Note that shields can only block [[Shields#Blocking|so many attacks]] in 1 turn, so they are less effective when fighting multiple opponents.
+*Even when counting unblockable attacks, a trained +8 tower shield can block >50% of all attacks you'll encounter in a game. Note that shields can only block [[Shields#Blocking|so many attacks]] in 1 turn, so they are less effective when fighting multiple opponents.
 *Meanwhile, upgrading from a [[double sword]] to a [[triple sword]] provides ~28% more base damage.
-At a glance, 30% less attacks and 30% more damage might seem balanced. But in ''Crawl'', raw defense is usually more valuable. The extra defense works when you aren't attacking; defense helps you survive an emergency. So, even when considering the Shields skill investment, and the penalties to EV/attack speed, shields are strong. That being said, two-handed is still somewhat viable, especially if you find a good [[artefact]], or have poor aptitude in Shields.
+At a glance, taking 30% less attacks and dealing 30% more damage might seem balanced. But in ''Crawl'', raw defense is usually more valuable. The extra defense works when you aren't attacking; defense helps you survive an emergency. So, even when considering the Shields skill investment, and the penalties to EV/attack speed, shields are strong. That being said, two-handed is still somewhat viable, especially if you find a good [[artefact]], or have poor aptitude in Shields.
 Other things worth noting:

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 Two-handed weapons deal more damage, but shields provide valuable defense. Which should you choose?
-*By the late game, a trained +8 [[tower shield]] could block >50% of all attacks for the entire game (''including'' the attacks you can't block).<ref>[https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/HorDDes/morgue-HorDDes-20240121-163555.txt Sample game]. This character blocked a total of 12962/20763 (62%) of all attacks. This includes the time spent without a shield, time with low Shields skill, time spent fighting multiple enemies at once, and counting unblockable attacks that check AC. (Does not count attacks that ignore both AC and SH, such as [[Smiting]].)</ref> A kite shield could block 30% of attacks.<ref>[https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/HorDDes/morgue-HorDDes-20231215-035912.txt Sample game 2]. The same factors apply here.</ref> Note that since shields can only block [[Shields#Blocking|so many attacks]] in 1 turn, they are less effective when fighting multiple opponents.
+*Even when counting unblockable attacks, a trained +8 tower shield can block >50% of all attacks in a game. Note that shields can only block [[Shields#Blocking|so many attacks]] in 1 turn, so they are less effective when fighting multiple opponents.
 *Meanwhile, upgrading from a [[double sword]] to a [[triple sword]] provides ~28% more base damage.
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 *[[0.12]] introduced [[cleaving]] for Axes. Prior to 0.12, there were two additional forms of handedness: hand-and-a-half weapons and double weapons. These each received further penalties when wielded with a shield, but were otherwise one-handed weapons.
 *[[0.10]] introduced innate [[reaching]] for Polearms.
 {{Guides}}

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 *Very common from monsters:
 **[[Centaur (monster)|Centaurs]] and [[centaur warrior]]s nearly always have a [[shortbow]] or [[orcbow]].
-**[[Kobold blastminer]]s often carry [[arbalest]]s or [[hand cannon]]s.
+**[[Kobold blastminer]]s often carry [[arbalest]]s and rarely carry [[hand cannon]]s.
 '''Disadvantages'''

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       smaller of: 0.7 OR base delay / 2
-With a few exceptions: [[rapier]]s are set to 0.5 delay, a few [[Ranged Weapons]] are locked to 1.0 delay.
+With a few exceptions: [[rapier]]s and [[quick blade]]s are set to 0.5 delay, a few [[Ranged Weapons]] are locked to 1.0 delay.
 Your delay is displayed in units of [[decaAut]]s (0.8, 1.1, etc). It is then slowed by a [[shield]], if wearing one. For [[Ranged Weapons]] exclusively, [[body armour]] also slows your attacks down.
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 *Highest damage melee weapon that uses dexterity.
 *Cross-trains with Short Blades, which also use dexterity, and have stronger stabs.
-*There are a couple good sources of Long Blades:
+<!--*There are a couple good sources of Long Blades:
 **[[Efreet]]s and [[Erica]] always spawn with a [[flaming]] scimitar (Good against [[hydra]]s!).
-**[[Wight]]s and [[list of deep elves|deep elves]] may also come with nice Long Blades.
+**[[Wight]]s and [[list of deep elves|deep elves]] may also come with nice Long Blades.-->
 '''Disadvantages'''

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 Two-handed weapons deal more damage, but shields provide valuable defense. Which should you choose?
-*By the late game, a trained +8 [[tower shield]] could block >50% of ''all'' attacks for the entire game (''including'' the attacks you can't block).<ref>[https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/HorDDes/morgue-HorDDes-20240121-163555.txt Sample game]. This example blocked a total of 12962/20763 (62%) of all attacks. This includes the time spent without a shield, time with low Shields skill, time spent fighting multiple enemies at once, and counting unblockable attacks.</ref> A kite shield could block 30% of attacks. Note that since shields can only block [[Shields#Blocking|so many attacks]] in 1 turn, they are less effective when fighting multiple opponents.
+*By the late game, a trained +8 [[tower shield]] could block >50% of ''all'' attacks for the entire game (''including'' the attacks you can't block).<ref>[https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/HorDDes/morgue-HorDDes-20240121-163555.txt Sample game]. This example blocked a total of 12962/20763 (62%) of all attacks. This includes the time spent without a shield, time with low Shields skill, time spent fighting multiple enemies at once, and counting unblockable attacks that check AC.</ref> A kite shield could block 30% of attacks. Note that since shields can only block [[Shields#Blocking|so many attacks]] in 1 turn, they are less effective when fighting multiple opponents.
 *Meanwhile, upgrading from a [[double sword]] to a [[triple sword]] provides ~28% more base damage.